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<Tom 7> (SPOILER) Huh. It looks like there's something more complicated going on here than I needed to solve it, even without guessing. I was just pattern matching on three panels in a row with a heart framer next to them and then a red floor... and then taking the center one. Oh, nevermind, I see what the rule is, and see what it has to do with the title now. ;) By the way--we've seen before that it's possible to work around 'undo' by making the negative consequences by choosing the wrong action affect you much later on than instant death. I'd like to see some more clever ways of forcing the player to figure out the rule instead of guessing for levels like this. |
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<Tom 7> It is a nice clock, but I agree the level itself is too easy; I solved it my first time without even knowing what the panels did. <Doom> The clock is cool, but the level itself is too simple. |
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<John Lewis> You're right... I just wanted to upload it because I thought the concept was pretty cool :) (and it was a "guessing" level that actually had logic behind it...) <Doom> I think that this worked better in CC. There's no unlimited undo, so you're forced to think how the level works (unless you use trial and error a lot). It's too easy to cheat in Escape. |
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<wowei> i did it! :] Especially the second part seemed impossible to solve at first. one of the finest levels in my opinion |
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<wowei> (SPOILER) hey, there was yet another truck. It's without tire-repairs again. |
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<wowei> (SPOILER) wow, hard to describe, why this one seems to be so hard and difficult. Finally I got it after some months, and the surprise facing the easy and fast solution at last is very astonishing. fabulous |
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<wowei> (SPOILER) So there's no going under the truck here. preparing the route, moving and pushing in circles, and finally going the prepared route reminds a bit of sokoban. nice! |
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<wowei> (SPOILER) oh my, I never really noticed that you can go "under the truck". I always thought it is one of the nearly unsolvable levels. Well, it still is a very-hard-to-see level and I simply love the picture. Perhaps now I can go and solve the other truck-level ;) (#807 "i htae the 405") |
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<Tom 7> (SPOILER) Added speedrun: 191 moves (old: 192). parallelize waiting and walking to save one move... |
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<mjn> This is a really cool level, and fun to work out on paper. I am glad I did not cheat. (Of course, that means it'll probably be another month before I finish it!) |
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<mjn> Yeah, man, this is definitely a tricky one. I don't want to spoil it for you, but here's a strategy I've found helpful on many levels, including this one: Try to rigorously prove things impossible (on paper, even, if necessary). Like, if you're thinking, "I don't think X can do Y", don't trust your judgement--try to prove outright that X can't do Y. Sometimes it can't, and then you can think clearer because there's one less thing to worry about; or sometimes it can, and finding a hole in your proof will lead you straight to the solution. <mm> (SPOILER) Hi John! How is your jungle fever, is it getting a little better? I must admit: I had not solved this level until today. Your text made me laugh, because it describes this special kind of "Escape-frustration" so very well! I had read what you'd written without understanding one single word... So I had to "open" the level, and believe it or not, within 5 minutes, I just walked out of the jungle - with an almost speedrun of 211 moves... It's too hard to be faster than noname, he's definatly the best speedrunner ever! (-: So in fact, I was laughing and not thinking, and this made me find the way out of the jungle. Just try to stop catching yourself within your own kind of thinking! Think different! You should know that. The most obvious way might be a trap. Sorry Max. But I guess my hints are more or less ok? Are they? |
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<John Lewis> (SPOILER) Whoops...that was supposed to be a speedrun... |
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<mm> (SPOILER) Hi John! This level is evil, I totally agree, but still I think it's one of the best levels ever! (-: SPOILER: As you already know, neither (1) nor (2) could help you to find a way out of this jungle (i.e. hell) - you seem to be caught in a vicious circle. My advice to get out of it: try to restart at the very beginning! Good luck! |
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<Alex> Working on 2.0 if that was too easy!!! |
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<John Lewis> (SPOILER) This. Is. Evil. I'm gonna have to ask for some help on this level, because I have burned my brain out trying to find a solution. I have found two methods that have gotten me pretty far: (1) Moving the gray sphere down and then left (and preferably not using the trap located to the right of the sphere's original location) to the niche. This allows the green sphere to get to the bottom. It appears that there is no way for the blue sphere to leave the bottom until the green sphere is on the green panel, unless the blue sphere is moved up, and either the gray or red sphere is pushed to the spot above the green panel and then pushed down on the green panel. Then I can push the blue sphere left, etc. However, this method seems to waste valuable traps. Or maybe I'm just not seeing something. So anyway, back to possible solution #1. Once the green sphere reaches the bottom, I can move it to the space on the left, run to the red sphere, push it left and then up to the top area. (Along the way, I push the blue sphere one space up.) Then I can manuever the green sphere right and down to the green panel. Now comes the hard part: The gray and red spheres are at the top. The ideal positions for them would be for the red sphere to be placed at the very top left (to allow the blue sphere to land on the blue panel) and the grey sphere to be moved down to the bottom left so that the blue sphere can be moved up. However, this uses up way too many traps. The red sphere has to be moved to the right and down, then the grey sphere must be moved to the right so both are adjacent to each other. At this point, I walk on the traps below the spheres and push both of them up. Then, I step on the trap to the right of the spheres. I push both of them left. They are together at the top left corner (gray on left, red on right). So now all I have to do is push the gray down and move the red left, right? If only it were that easy. At this point, the blue sphere could be moved up via the positioning of the gray, but there is no way for me to push the red sphere all the way to the red panel. I would have to move it right, down, and then right again, and I don't have enough traps. So solution #1 doesn't seem to work...unless there is just some kind of special combination of trap-stepping I just haven't seen yet. (2) In this solution, I move the gray sphere down before touching the green. Unfortunately, I have to step on the trap to the right of the gray to do this. When the gray is nestled at the bottom left (where it will be permenantly), I can move the red sphere to the left and then up. Now the red sphere is at the top, and the green sphere still hasn't been moved. The most trap-efficient (hey, that sounds pretty cool! :)) way to get the green sphere to the bottom is to move the red to the right (where the gray originally started), move the green all the way left, and then move the red down one space. Then I can manuever the red and green spheres in a series of pushes similar to the end of solution #1, where both spheres eventually end up at the top left (green on left, red on right). Then the green can be pushed down, red can be pushed left, blue can be pushed up, green pushed right and then down, and then finally, the blue can be pushed to the left and then up on the blue panel. Unfortunately, just like the last solution, there is no way for the red to be manuevered to the red panel. I think it's possible to get it as far as being pushed right (where the gray sphere originally was, but the traps above would have already been used by then. :( So...I can't think of anything else. Somebody please help. This is driving me mad! |
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<Eric119> (SPOILER) Added solution "Another solution": Another method of solving the level which takes the same amount of time as the speedrun I just uploaded. (I actually found this solution first.) |
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<John Lewis> (SPOILER) Solved! Brilliant level, mjn. This is difficulty, style, and rigidity all at their finest. :) And talk about a devious twist at the end... |
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<RC> (SPOILER) Added speedrun: 369 moves (old: 381). Since there were many ways to solve this one I thought it might be possible to get another block out. |
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<mm> (SPOILER) 5213 moves, uughngh... I'm just glad it's done (: |
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<mm> (SPOILER) I did solve the first level exactly "this" way, so to me the mod would not make it more difficult. The concept is great, I like both levels (: |
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<bpotetz> (SPOILER) I agree - very cool idea, RC. You can still solve it if the blue & green electric panels on the sides are shifted down one. Otherwise, I think it's surprisingly rigid. <mjn> This is really cool. |
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