| « home | Browsing all comments (spoilers: on | off) (info: on | off) | next 25 |
 |
<bpotetz> OK, lazybones. About the memoryless levels: All three have substantially different solutions, so keeping them all wouldn't really be so bad. I think they're all pretty interesting levels, and I can't figure out why no one is playing them. But if you want to get rid of one, the first one is flawed because you can cook it by solving it using the solution to version 2. Of course, I could fix it so it wasn't cookable... <bpotetz> Yeah - this is a better fix than the electric strip, I think. Nice level, mjn. <bpotetz> I am defeated! <Tom 7> Okay, I got rid of all of them but this one (-->graveyard). Brian, it's your call on the Memoryless Hole ones. Which one(s) should we keep? Do they have substantially different solutions (I haven't solved them yet..) |
 |
<bpotetz> (SPOILER) Cook: Cool idea, guys. I like levels based on abstract concepts, esp cool np-complete ones like satisfiability. Unfortunately, there's a couple ways to cook this one. The easiest is to just ensure that there is some non-zero number of green sphere in each column, and stop pushing them down one you get one in. You could stop this by installing a grey sphere at the bottom of each column that can only be moved down, onto a panel that locks the player into the column until they push down a second grey sphere (from the top of the column) that unlocks them. The other potential cook is that rows don't have ot be ternary - you can shift one partially in either direction. But that could be intentional. Anyway, I count 4 ternary solutions (and no binary solutions). |
|
|
<mjn> Okay, this is *really* my final version now--I even put "final" in the title. If this gets cooked, it can stay cooked! (As for deletin', this is the only one I care about; I think at least one of Brian's Memoryless Holes would be cool to have, too.) |
 |
<Max> Can we start deleting unnecessary old versions of this and mods (if any) so I don't have to solve them? ;) <Tom 7> I agree that a strip of electric on the bottom will call too much attention to the blue sphere. |
|
|
<Tom 7> (SPOILER) Here's another encoding of n-SAT in CNF. Aside from the crap having to due with blocking in the columns after you select assignments, this is a pretty dense encoding. Note the innovative use of breakable blocks for decorative effect, due to William. |
|
|
<mjn> (SPOILER) Okay, here are my thoughts on fixing it: Item #1: If, at any point, the two black spheres are next to the laser, the panel must be used. Proof: The second (leftmost) can't move until the first moves, and the first must go down. The second must then go right, because you can't stand in front of the laser to push it left. At this point, it can't go up or down, so it has to go into the hole. Item #2: If there is electricity below the two black spheres, then they must go into the hole-area, and before any other spheres can. Proof: At the start, the blacks can't go up or down without disappearing, and the can't go left without some other sphere first getting stuck on the left wall, so they have to go right. The last blue is the only colored sphere that can be pulled out of line safely, and it can't go into the hole before the blacks because there's no way to bring a block down until three spheres are lined up at the hole. It may still be possible to destroy a black and then use a block in its place, but you'd still have to take a green or red out of order, which could only mean catching it with the blue once it's on the right wall, and then there'd be no way to get the blue in before it. Anyone see any holes in this? <mjn> (SPOILER) Yeah, I was thinking about the strip of electricity, but I'm worried that it might draw too much attention to the last blue sphere's unique situation. I was also thinking about putting a black square in the bottom right corner of the main space, like you did in Memoryless Hole #2. Would that break your cook? (Mine involved bringing the second black sphere down, then bringing a red down on top of it.) <bpotetz> (SPOILER) Hmmmm. My intuition is that if we add a strip of electric at the bottom, like in Memoryless Hole v4, that should make it impossible. Not quite 100% sure, though - it's close. For example, I think that level would have been cookable if the blue panels surrounding the memory hole were electric. I'll let mjn have the honors, though, at his leisure. The basic idea of the level is very cool. |
 |
<Tom 7> Yeah. ;) |
|
|
<Tom 7> (SPOILER) Ah, we gotta get an uncookable version --- any tips, Brian? |
|
|
<Max> Hey, it worked! This is a very cool thing to know for... I guess just this situation! ;) |
 |
<mjn> (SPOILER) Ouch, you got me once again. I should have known there'd be a way to get a block inside... I think I'll just leave this one in. (Been through enough of these in the last couple days...) |
|
|
<bpotetz> (SPOILER) Cook: Booyah! This is too good to describe in a post. You'll have to solve it yourself in yet another memoryless level. (You came really close that time, mjn) |
|
|
<Max> Okay, I guess I'll fix this at Some Point, then! |
 |
<Max> Wow, this one is really, really hard, Brian! |
|
|
<Tom 7> Well, the game keeps backups of the player file, which is where the old solutions are stored. If you browse inside Escape.App/Contents/MacOS you can find them; they'll be called something like Max.esp~2559. The biggest number will be the newest. To recover it, rename it to something like Max2.esp. Then on the player select screen, choose Import and type Max2.esp. Also, the solution that you uploaded when you uploaded the level is probably still on the server, but there's currently no way to make use of it. I'm adding that stuff at some point... <Max> Hey Tom, is there, by any chance, a way to recover old solutions? I just solved this without using the grey blocks and now I can't remember at all why I used them in the first place. The frustrating part is that I remember that it was a REALLY intricate solution that I spent a lot of time on. Oh well... |
|
|
<mjn> After much consideration, I'm pretty sure that this version finally does away with all the non-panel solutions, so I'm gonna call this the "final" version. (Since Memoryless Hole preserves those solutions, I guess versions 1 and 3 could be deleted, if you want, Tom.) |
|
|
<Max> (SPOILER) Oh awesome, I forgot that I can just watch my solution in fast-forward mode. Yeah, I used them. Hm. <Max> (SPOILER) Man, I hardly even remember, but I think that I did use those grey blocks. I'll get around to fixing this maybe. Maybe not... |
 |
<Max> (SPOILER) Cook: I solved this without using the "hole"... |
| « home | Browsing all comments (spoilers: on | off) (info: on | off) | next 25 |