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<Dave> (SPOILER) Morning (Evening) Mark. ctrl-e sorts by the 'Solved' count in the ratings. I've had levels like Play Escape 2, and there have seemingly been dozens of them, unsolved for ages. You begin to get the hang of bot-shoving in the end, doesn't make it any less annoying though. I tend to attack these levels like this: Rule 1. Turn on bot numbering and beware number 1. Rule 2. Get as much as you from the inside without releasing the bots. Rule 3. When you do have to work with bots clear the smallest rooms first whilst you have the fewest bots to worry about. Rule 4. Leave the outside as intact as possible, it's your best ally. Rule 5. Take the outside line on the non-exit corners. You don't want to be collecting corners at the end. Rule 6. Leave plenty of hearts near the exit to manoeuvre with at the end. The rest is patience and worn out 'u' key. For revenge 3: Yes, grey must go in. Two greys in, one out of the way, and three blues together. <mark> (SPOILER) So its not just me then i'm losing solutions all over the shop. I collect every speedrun and different solution i can catch only for about half of them to dissapear. I now even run solution threw and bookmark as my solve and they still go. THe weardest one is dialetic in delete files as i hold speedrun for that level yet it is not solved in my folder.(i dont rate or speedrun deleted files anymore but at that time i had not got one and wanted to see how it worked) Ploding along in triage 31 since last milestone there getting harder to find nice levels to play. I've probably looked at every level and realisticly think 1750 to 1800 is all i can achieve. I have not done 1 level yet thats against the timer and have only 1 hard block pushy sokoban type game.(avalanche 2). I haven't and don't think i ever will get one by the pieguy ( i now know who he is )but i do understand the levels if that makes any sense.Mod 14 and wrong parity being the only 2 i have a chance at but not even going to try them yet. Good look with " block cipher " Dave. Thats a level i dont understand one little bit i dont even understand the comments about the level. Revenge 3 is what i keep playing but to no avail i can start that level grey grey or grey blue but not getting much further. if someone could help me on the opening moves i might be able to stick with it a bit more. for example unless i'm totally wrong grey has to go in first but does it go all the way across or just one move in. Jim dont no how to rate RotRB yet as i solved it my own way and your solution just fit the other 2. I dont know if i would have found it without a struggle. Ps i can't be that good at this game i cant do "play escape 2" without getting a faceful of bots and then quickly giving up. Pps Ctrl + e works but i cannot work out what the order is about. Thanks all. |
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<mark> (SPOILER) Added speedrun: 1222 moves (old: 1266). original |
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<Dave> Then again, I only discovered ctrl-e today, so what do I know? <Dave> The MD5s are different... can't make sense of it yet. Another inexplicable thing: A couple of days ago I 'lost' all solutions to gnomme deux. No other levels, just that one... <Dave> I did just ctrl-0 it no problem. Funny thing is when I did that my solution and my tick against the second version mysteriously disappeared. So, I tried deleting all solutions from all of these levels except for my original solve of the first one, close escape, go back in, and the solutions are gone for all the levels except for my 1548 first solve of the original. However, every time I ctrl-0 anyb of them your 1222 run pops up from nowhere. Got me stumped! <Jim> (SPOILER) Sorry Dave, you cant CTRL 0 this one, if its any consolation, I had to do it over again too. A weird thing happened to me on modular thinking 15, after I uploaded that it didn't even show that I solved it when I got back into that level. It didn't save any bookmarks for that level either. <Dave> Hi Jim, I just ctrl-0ed your upload but to be fair I rated as previous because I didn't spot the mistake the first round! |
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<Dave> (SPOILER) Oops! It just got funnier. Just watched Kirima's speedrun: I utterly failed to notice the changes on the far left. Why do I always do things the hard way?! Still, why use 2 daleks when 3 are available anyway? <Dave> Guess we've a few more level titles now, are you planning on continuing this? <Dave> (SPOILER) Thanks Jim, I really enjoyed that. Thought I was cooking it only to find out that the 'cook' is the proper solution. Very funny! |
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<Dave> (SPOILER) Added speedrun: 1251 moves (old: 1814). A little bit tidier |
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<Dave> PS. My first, and so far only solve, was about 1900 moves and the same as yours in the important aspects. May try and tidy it up later if I have time. <Dave> Nice job Mark! The ratings are a realistic comment on the series at this stage, and not about the job you did :) Even though I started with a pretty good idea of how to attack it, it still took a while. I think that has formally answered the question about whether we should stop at this point with a very loud and resounding NO. I would have been extremely surprised if 13 didn't have a cook of this nature, it was never intended as a fait accompli, which is why made no comment on the subject of stopping. Will leave 13 up just for now to see if anybody wants to keep it as an intermediate level. Onward... The respite from all the 'mods' yestertday did give me a chance to finally knock off The Wrong Parity. Pen and paper solution took about 5 hours in the end, would have been quicker if I hadn't completely missed the whopper of a clue in the title! Two more to go before I finally have no choice but to make an attempt at Block Cipher. Also finally downloaded the SDL libraries, so I may have a tinker with the source code. How's your triage quest going? <mark> (SPOILER) Spent quite a while playing 13 the wrong way to see if i could do it differently, so i could make a mod for you to play Dave. Hope you get even a third of the enjoyment i did out of "Red Balloon" |
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<mm> (SPOILER) Added speedrun: 794 moves (old: 803). Got it :) |
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<noname> It should be "occurred". I guess a claim for misspelling must itself contain some mispeling. |
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<Jim> (SPOILER) MM, my level can be solved by looking at a previous deleted version. I would have never solved it in a million years if I hadn't seen it. Mark, it takes a while to fall asleep sometimes if I have a level that is bothering me. So far, no nightmares though! Dave, I'm working on a version that brings the red bot and the remotes back into play. Its always dangerous however, because it is supremely difficult to stop all the cooks and I don't want to do anything that gives away your solution to red balloon. |
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<Jim> (SPOILER) Added speedrun: 1595 moves (old: 1746). I didn't work very hard on the speed run, I know it can go a lot lower. |
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<Jim> (SPOILER) It seems fine to me also, nice job! |
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<mark> (SPOILER) Hi back after my 2 day break,i see Dave your funny as well as clever nice one. Just speedrun red balloon which was a tidied up version of my original solve, bet you can tidy it a bit more. Its to late to look at mod 13, dont want to fry my brain before going to bed. Done that many of times before and i end up dreaming blocks. Dreamt up many of good puzzles whilst i'm sleeping but they dont make any sense in the morning. Does this game pop into anyone else's dreams? <Dave> (SPOILER) One counter-example that immediately comes to mind is Nice Airport. Where would that level be without the misdirection and redundant parts? noname's mod could probably get away without them because it has a great puzzle within the puzzle, but the original wouldn't be the same. Mind you, The Only Dalek is the perfect counter-counter-example. So that's that theory out the window! It does seem to be an unfortunate side effect of multiple modding that you inevitably end up with clutter. Somehow getting rid of it just doesn't feel right, it's like deleting other people's work, and I don't feel particularly comfortable doing that without their permission. So most of tends to get left behind in the hope that it will be re-incorporated later. I would be happy with a cleaned up version of the Red Balloon, but I would be much happier to see a version that brings the red bot and remotes back into play in a meaningful way. <mm> (SPOILER) I see what you mean and in general, I do agree. But once the ancestors of a level are deleted, those "red herrings" just don't make any sense any more, at least in the triage folder. To me, the triage folder had always been the place to go, I never really cared too much about the other folders. What you're saying does make a lot of sense once the history of a level is important - but once the ancestors are deleted, there is no more "history". I do understand your point, but I also understand my point of view. Good night, and I'm wishing you all a lovely Sunday! <Dave> I half agree. If it was a brand new level I would totally agree. I can only speak for myself, but I tend to leave the redundant bits in as a matter of historical interest. The level has developed organically and they show the process. Clearly in both levels the red bot is out of play, and in the Red Balloon, the three remotes are out of play because they no longer do anything worthwhile. The same applies to the bomb, the space has to filled with something so why not leave it there. Everything else is used, in fact some of the other mechanisms have developed more purpose. The trick to Jim's mod will also be needed in my version. In most other respects the intended solutions are very different, even though the Red Balloon solution is backwards compatible. <mm> (SPOILER) And it's me again... How can I get a solution from a level that is sitting in the triage folder when it's ancestor is in the minor leagues? I guess I can't, can I. But you did it, Dave! How? |
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